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Old March 26th, 2009 #1
Alex Linder
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Default Linder on WN Ethics (How to Infight)

We saw, a few years ago, the risible non-aggression pact in New Orleans. The assembled worthies, led by Duke and Black, agreed, loftily, not to criticize signatories, ie one another. It was characteristic of the low Protestant mindset that is the milieu from which WN springs that nobody at the conference audibly dissented from the hypocrisy nor pointed out that such a pact primarily would serve the benefit of protecting wrongdoers. It's the traditional WN way - close ranks against critics, no matter their criticism be factual. It's part cult, part Southern Evangelical-cultural. It is the wrong way.

Here's the right way to do it.

How to Fight with WN You Don't Like

Too many WN are of low character. If they dislike another WN, the mere fact alone will lead them to relax what ought to be high standards. That is, they will circulate any lie or rumor without respect to its truth, caring only that the stick will do damage to their enemy.

This hurts our cause. It is the wrong thing to do. It is the wrong way to act.

WN should refrain from lying about other WN they don't like. They should not allow their organs or facilities to be used to traduce the character of their rivals. Factual criticism, on the other hand, is perfectly valid, and should be allowed to be expressed, and should be expressed.

If so-called WN refuse to conduct themselves honorably, the right thing to do is to ostracize them. To explain the reason for the ostracism in neutral terms to anyone who asks, but on the whole ignore these people, warn others against them, and deny any who seek to use your facilities to promote defective men and organizations.

It is a measure of the low standads of too many WN that they resort casually and immediately to the worst sorts of lies the minute they have any falling out with a party.

WN B falls out with WN C. WN B and his cronies begin the smear:

C is a drunk/homo/womanizer/pederast/crook/drug addict/fed/informant/jew.

It is impossible to overstate how destructive this casual lying is. It prevents WN from developing. We are already in a situation in which our enemy tries to subvert us and smear us to others. When we lie about each other, we make his job easy and our job impossible.

This is the reason that here at VNN you are not allowed to promote Billy Roper's White Revolution, nor Dicky Barrett's organization. Liars and smearmongers may call themselves White nationalists but they detract from the cause. Have nothing to do with them.

Anyone who participates in the smearing of another faction will be verboten here. Anyone who upholds standards will be allowed to promote himself or his circle here.

White is not enough. There must be character and behavioral standards too.

Last edited by Alex Linder; June 21st, 2012 at 04:35 PM.
 
Old March 26th, 2009 #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Linder View Post
We saw, a few years ago, the risible non-aggression pact in New Orleans. The assembled worthies, led by Duke and Black, agreed, loftily, not to criticize signatories, ie one another. It was characteristic of the low Protestant mindset that is the milieu from which WN springs that nobody at the conference audibly dissented from the hypocrisy nor pointed out that such a pact primarily would serve the benefit of protecting wrongdoers. It's the traditional WN way - close ranks against critics, no matter their criticism be factual. It's part cult, part Southern Evangelical-cultural. It is the wrong way.

Here's the right way to do it.

How to Fight with WN You Don't Like

Too many WN are of low character. If they dislike another WN, the mere fact alone will lead them to relax what ought to be high standards. That is, they will circulate any lie or rumor without respect to its truth, caring only that the stick will do damage to their enemy.

This hurts our cause. It is the wrong thing to do. It is the wrong way to act.

WN should refrain from lying about other WN they don't like. They should not allow their organs or facilities to be used to traduce the character of their rivals. Factual criticism, on the other hand, is perfectly valid, and should be allowed to be expressed, and should be expressed.

If so-called WN refuse to conduct themselves honorably, the right thing to do is to ostracize them. To explain the reason for the ostracism in neutral terms to anyone who asks, but on the whole ignore these people, warn others against them, and deny any who seek to use your facilities to promote defective men and organizations.

It is a measure of the low standads of too many WN that they resort casually and immediately to the worst sorts of lies the minute they have any falling out with a party.

WN B falls out with WN C. WN B and his cronies begin the smear:

C is a drunk/homo/womanizer/pederast/crook/drug addict.

It is impossible to overstate how destructive this casual lying is. It prevents WN from developing. We are already in a situation in which our enemy tries to subvert us and smear us to others. When we lie about each other, we make his job easy and our job impossible.

This is the reason that here at VNN you are not allowed to promote Billy Roper's White Revolution, nor Dicky Barrett's organization. Liars and smearmongers may call themselves White nationalists but they detract from the cause. Have nothing to do with them.

Anyone who participates in the smearing of another faction will be verboten here. Anyone who upholds standards, like John de Nugent, will be allowed to promote himself or his circle here.

White is not enough. There must be character and behavioral standards too.
I agree and it comes down to the fact which is the more powerful, or more important? The promotion of self or the promotion of the cause? Is it acceptable to resort to anything in order to advance the cause?

Too many WN's believe it's acceptable to argue and fight with another with the sole purpose of the cause being the shining light, the beacon that guides them.

It's so true that everything we do, starts with self. It's the way we conduct ourselves that defines us in society.

Too many confuse promotion of self with cause and get stuck in a dreadful mire of muck-racking and dissension.
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Old March 26th, 2009 #3
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You know what the stereotype of the racial-thinking white person is. They say, oh, they're just making up for some personal inadequacy, maybe a punk teenager who got beat up makes himself feel strong by thinking tough about stormtroopers, or somebody who lost in business blames it on a jew, etc etc. they portray white nationalists as losers essentially.

like most propaganda-- like most stereotypes-- there's a grain of truth in it.

first off, naturally, people who are not sharing in the inducements of the current system, will tend to be more critical of it. they will see some things that the average joe does not want to see.

secondly sure, a socially unfashionable way of thinking, will tend to draw a sample of adherents that are more comfortable being socially disfavored.

neither of these two things is an argument about the truth of the content of WN as a social or poltical idea. just a sort of ad hominem, which even if the stereotype is true, it may be that the premises and conclusions of WN are true as well.

all that said, any "movement" to be successful it must police its own kind, with standards of acceptable conduct, first and foremost amongst themselves. but vis a vis outsiders too, there have to be some standards.

you have to look like you can take out your own garbage. people who would be potential adherents will simply not join if they think we can't take our own garbage. they say if they cant take out their own garbage how will they do it for the nation as a whole?

it gets down to organizational competence. if you dont show it, you wont be able to recruit.
 
Old March 26th, 2009 #4
Tom McReen
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Quote:
Too many WN are of low character. If they dislike another WN, the mere fact alone will lead them to relax what ought to be high standards. That is, they will circulate any lie or rumor without respect to its truth, caring only that the stick will do damage to their enemy.

This hurts our cause. It is the wrong thing to do. It is the wrong way to act.

WN should refrain from lying about other WN they don't like. They should not allow their organs or facilities to be used to traduce the character of their rivals. Factual criticism, on the other hand, is perfectly valid, and should be allowed to be expressed, and should be expressed.

If so-called WN refuse to conduct themselves honorably, the right thing to do is to ostracize them. To explain the reason for the ostracism in neutral terms to anyone who asks, but on the whole ignore these people, warn others against them, and deny any who seek to use your facilities to promote defective men and organizations.

It is a measure of the low standads of too many WN that they resort casually and immediately to the worst sorts of lies the minute they have any falling out with a party.

WN B falls out with WN C. WN B and his cronies begin the smear:

C is a drunk/homo/womanizer/pederast/crook/drug addict.

It is impossible to overstate how destructive this casual lying is. It prevents WN from developing. We are already in a situation in which our enemy tries to subvert us and smear us to others. When we lie about each other, we make his job easy and our job impossible.
This is very close to what I have pondering over recently.
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Old March 26th, 2009 #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom McReen View Post
This is very close to what I have pondering over recently.
Did you come to a conclusion? Like, refraining from doing it, perhaps?
--------------


I've noticed this in England. Not so much with the specific insinuations and names that Alex mentioned, but for some reason, we seem to go round in circles accusing each other of being "reds" and "state". The next week, everyone is the best of pals again, but there is always someone ready to cash in on previous tensions.
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Old March 26th, 2009 #6
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I blame part of it on the "personality cult". In that respect historical NS did do us no favour in depicting Hitler as some kind of "Messiah" who single-handedly solved all the problems.

What is the point of arguing about another persons character, at an internet message board at that, as if that would change anything. Best is to refrain from anything on a personal level altogether and concentrate solely on the politics and political arguments.
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Old March 26th, 2009 #7
Alex Linder
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Originally Posted by alex View Post
What is the point of arguing about another persons character, at an internet message board at that, as if that would change anything. Best is to refrain from anything on a personal level altogether and concentrate solely on the politics and political arguments.
I agree. It is very difficult to get American WN to do this, though. Mainly because 'the movement,' by which mean NA, has always acted as though criticism is disloyalty, and critics must be destroyed by the group operating in lockstep using whatever smears and lies work most efficaciously. It is this culture VNN has tried to change.
 
Old March 26th, 2009 #8
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I agree there’s an issue with unscrupulous time wasters who join the WN cause out of a desire to inflate their ego and argue with others rather than show goodwill to fellow whites and contribute news and perspectives about the racial situation. Fortunately I have not experienced any negative personal exchanges with other posters here. I only joined this forum fairly recently but I was little disappointed at the amount of bickering and petty disputes I saw erupting on certain threads. Some of this as you may realise was likely instigated by purposeful infiltrators who were not WNs to begin with. But even those without a covert agenda can still forget what this cause is about. And one thing that is needed is more camaraderie, unity, and forgiveness to others who say an unkind word in a heated argument. Personality differences will always exist but we should focus on a common goal and remember to ease off when debates turn bitter.

As for lying, I wouldn’t dream of slandering another WN (or anyone for that matter), and anyone who does cannot be regarded as honourable or even committed to the ideals of WN.

Finishing on a positive note I would say there’s many bright, literate and perceptive people in the movement, so as long as they hang around then further progress can be made.
 
Old March 26th, 2009 #9
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I take it it's still alright to "smear" non-whites and non-WN though? Even with lies?
 
Old March 26th, 2009 #10
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Originally Posted by Larry Heinberg View Post
I take it it's still alright to "smear" non-whites and non-WN though? Even with lies?
No, It would be pointless. Ye were smeared before st the point of conception.
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Old March 26th, 2009 #11
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Muds are a smear upon humanity. We don't have to lie.
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Old March 26th, 2009 #12
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Originally Posted by MikeTodd View Post
Muds are a smear upon humanity. We don't have to lie.
I beat you to it. I am faster than you, Ha Ha
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Old March 26th, 2009 #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Linder View Post

If so-called WN refuse to conduct themselves honorably, the right thing to do is to ostracize them.
Good strategy. The Amish use it, and apparently it works.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Linder View Post

White is not enough. There must be character and behavioral standards too.
Agreed. In fact, I feel that character is a big part of being truly White. It's the difference between white and White.
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Old March 26th, 2009 #14
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It's not, purely, or even mostly, a White Nationalist thing, so much as the nature of Internet discussion forums. I hang out on the yachtfourms.com sometimes just to see all the beautiful boats, and you've got flames going on there, never mind what happens in a political forum.

Back in the real old days I posted a lot in the craigslist political forum, which is just a zoo. I argued all the time there that you can never get most people to behave themselves as they would in a real space unless you take away their anonymity.
 
Old March 26th, 2009 #15
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Originally Posted by DouglasReed View Post
It's not, purely, or even mostly, a White Nationalist thing, so much as the nature of Internet discussion forums. I hang out on the yachtfourms.com sometimes just to see all the beautiful boats, and you've got flames going on there, never mind what happens in a political forum.

Back in the real old days I posted a lot in the craigslist political forum, which is just a zoo. I argued all the time there that you can never get most people to behave themselves as they would in a real space unless you take away their anonymity.
I agree. And the only way the anonymity is going to end is when we begin organizing offline. I am beginning a humble group in my area to practice shooting, talk about issues that affect us racially and begin growing our own food. Basically the 'Kievsky' model of White community/survival. Maybe if we form enough of these small groups we can move on from there to something bigger and more influential.

I'm not too confident with waiting for some benevolent White-elite to save us and our children from the Jewish death star and its simian storm troopers. Much rather be pro-active.

You would think that with the cream of the kosher crop of enemies we have to pick from, we wouldn't need to kick each other in the virtual ass.
 
Old March 26th, 2009 #16
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Quote:
White is not enough. There must be character and behavioral standards too.
Exactly.

At times there will be people that fall below a standard, they are also not to be dismissed. These people can be guided back into civilization.

The catch phrase most use is this Awaking .

Some have a longer road to travel than others. Mentors are few and far between in the WN movement, which I feel this is a great shame.

Notice I used the word mentors, not leaders. Many people I have come across hold the values of the WN movement to the best of a workable standard, but are overlooked due to they are not in the media etc.

Many need to stop idol worship, and reassess why they are WN in the first place.
 
Old March 27th, 2009 #17
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So what happens if a non-white, or a non-WN meets the character and behaviour standards?

So many mysteries!
 
Old March 27th, 2009 #18
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Exactly.


Many need to stop idol worship, and reassess why they are WN in the first place.
And that's the crux of the matter; too many worship hip hop figures. post ww2 modern” noise music (see Jew culture counterfeiter)they look to Paul mc Cartney and even as far back as Elvis, Frank Sinatra(movie stars) IQ of 100, as gods.Filthy zog elevates lowest common denominator as idol and as heroes in entertainment industry.
 
Old March 27th, 2009 #19
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Originally Posted by Lex Talionis View Post
I agree. And the only way the anonymity is going to end is when we begin organizing offline. I am beginning a humble group in my area to practice shooting, talk about issues that affect us racially and begin growing our own food. Basically the 'Kievsky' model of White community/survival. Maybe if we form enough of these small groups we can move on from there to something bigger and more influential.
That's definitely the way to go. You need to have people you can count on when things really start to fall apart, and the skills to survive in that situation. I highly recommend Eric Thomson's writings if you aren't already familiar with them.
 
Old March 27th, 2009 #20
Alex Linder
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Originally Posted by DouglasReed View Post
It's not, purely, or even mostly, a White Nationalist thing, so much as the nature of Internet discussion forums. I hang out on the yachtfourms.com sometimes just to see all the beautiful boats, and you've got flames going on there, never mind what happens in a political forum.

Back in the real old days I posted a lot in the craigslist political forum, which is just a zoo. I argued all the time there that you can never get most people to behave themselves as they would in a real space unless you take away their anonymity.
the internet is a faggoty medium by nature - anonymous, shifty, scummy. we have worked to overcome the cover the internet gives scummy behavior thru our rules, including making people sign up with ordinary names and exerting strong downward pressure on the fantasy aspect. this is not the case at other WN-oriented forums. there is far less virtual fantasy here than elsewhere. less klanfederated snotzis from outer space at VNNF than elsewhere. that is good, sez me.

get out of the internet's what good in it - information. but dont complain it's not what it can't be. typing is not fighting. we are not warriors. should you feel moved to created a genuine real-world body, of some sort, in reaction to the information here discovered, why in many ways i think that would be an appropriate response. i recommend a local network, for self-defense, skills development, and fun.
 
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