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Old 1 Week Ago #41
Tom Rogers
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andy View Post
I do not think urging modern youth of the dot com generation to self educate themselves with book learning will get very far.
the 35 characters available at twitter seem to much effort for most of them to read and understand.
To be fair, though, that's his whole point. True, very few adults, let alone young people, will want to be reading dusty books, but then, only special people need apply. The leaders of Nationalism will need both brains and brawn, and the qualities are self-selecting. Those without the patience to read and without the capability to do things cannot lead in the way that is needed.

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Originally Posted by andy View Post
Owen's is finding out video by video that analogue campaigning does not work in the 21st century.
Personally I think he is doing fine. Political momentum is needed, and for Nationalists the starting-point may as well be at the community level and in local government. Nobody pretends that sorting out housing problems or dog bins is the path to white racial salvation, but unless we are in touch with people's problems, we will have no effective way of conveying our beliefs to the public.

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Originally Posted by andy View Post
Those that regard Robinson as "one of their own" are unlikely to seek out a book by an obscure nationalist politician leave alone read and understand it.
To be fair, he's not aiming his videos at the types who would align with Robinson unthinkingly. He's trying to steer young people with leadership potential away from that.

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Originally Posted by andy View Post
They are even less likely to take advice from a "security Consultant" still active in the Merseyside night club scene not to join gangs. [/url]
Personally I see nothing wrong with his background. I should stress that I don't know him and have never met him, but I do know about his past and I take the view that the past is the past. What matters is what he does and says now, and whether he has learned the right lessons, and it seems to me he has. Like I say, you need brains and physicality - you need both to be a really good leader. Owens has a commanding physical presence, he is sincere, and he's also got brains, as we can see from his largely excellent videos. He'd be the first to admit that he's not the finished product and he has baggage, but I'll take him any day over any of the supposedly 'squeaky clean' politicians who have betrayed us.
 
Old 1 Week Ago #42
andy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Rogers View Post
To be fair, though, that's his whole point. True, very few adults, let alone young people, will want to be reading dusty books, but then, only special people need apply. The leaders of Nationalism will need both brains and brawn, and the qualities are self-selecting. Those without the patience to read and without the capability to do things cannot lead in the way that is needed.



Personally I think he is doing fine. Political momentum is needed, and for Nationalists the starting-point may as well be at the community level and in local government. Nobody pretends that sorting out housing problems or dog bins is the path to white racial salvation, but unless we are in touch with people's problems, we will have no effective way of conveying our beliefs to the public.



To be fair, he's not aiming his videos at the types who would align with Robinson unthinkingly. He's trying to steer young people with leadership potential away from that.



Personally I see nothing wrong with his background. I should stress that I don't know him and have never met him, but I do know about his past and I take the view that the past is the past. What matters is what he does and says now, and whether he has learned the right lessons, and it seems to me he has. Like I say, you need brains and physicality - you need both to be a really good leader. Owens has a commanding physical presence, he is sincere, and he's also got brains, as we can see from his largely excellent videos. He'd be the first to admit that he's not the finished product and he has baggage, but I'll take him any day over any of the supposedly 'squeaky clean' politicians who have betrayed us.
He states in the video that he is directly addressing,scrambling bike riders,pot smokers and gang joiners surely the bedrock of Robinson's support. Like Robinson he would find his background an asset should he have any dealings with them.
In his previous video he advises a teenager to gather his mates from School and form a committee complete with a secretary and treasurer and then campaign on local issues.Now he advises reading a book as the best way forward.
He has not differentiated clearly, either this is general advice to all or it is specific to nationalists.
While his vlogging on movement disruption by the system are excellent his solutions for creating ethical nationalism in the UK without an existing structure will not work.If the British people were self starters capable of self education the current situation would never have happened in the first place.
He needs an editor and advisor and needs to determine whether he is appealing to the movement or the masses they are not the same thing.
He has stated that he is appealing to the youth (so not the movement?) but keeps referring to historical movement activity which for good or ill mean nothing to millennials and are a negative failure to over 30's.
He is to be commended for making his videos and running for office but he needs to review his recommendations to new people.
He has regularly stated the electorate are not interested in the Kalergi plan and similar movement ballocks. He should realise the same applies to Tyndall and Griffin in the minds of the electorate.The last two are even contentious in movement circles.
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Old 6 Days Ago #43
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Who is the 'Tommy' in the '#Free Tommy' signs along I-280 in San Francisco?


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A graffiti campaign in support of a jailed hate-mongering Brit has reached San Francisco, the last place you might expect to see any sympathy for such an effort.
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Old 5 Days Ago #44
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Trying to Create Martyr
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Old 5 Days Ago #45
Tom Rogers
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Originally Posted by Phaedrus View Post
It's standard for low-risk prisoners in England to be moved around the system. Usually they are held for up to a few weeks in a local prison like Hull before being moved to one of the lower-security prisons for resettlement. Onley, where Robinson is now, is a Category 'C' prison, which means it's a closed regime but minimum security. English prisons are relatively 'soft' with generally very good rehabilitation, but the downside of that is it can mean close contact with some quite dangerous offenders.

It does look like an unforced error on the part of the system, driven by bureaucracy and adherence to policy rather than any sort of malice.

Last edited by Tom Rogers; 5 Days Ago at 06:45 AM.
 
Old 5 Days Ago #46
Tom Rogers
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andy View Post
He states in the video that he is directly addressing,scrambling bike riders,pot smokers and gang joiners surely the bedrock of Robinson's support. Like Robinson he would find his background an asset should he have any dealings with them.
In his previous video he advises a teenager to gather his mates from School and form a committee complete with a secretary and treasurer and then campaign on local issues.Now he advises reading a book as the best way forward.
He has not differentiated clearly, either this is general advice to all or it is specific to nationalists.
The book recommendation and the advice about forming ad hoc committees were in the same video. I think he is aiming his advice at both types of people, but especially at people who do not have a background in nationalism, as that will allow them to appear as 'new faces'.

He did go into his own wayward youth, but he explained how political nationalism (as opposed to Robinson-style activism) saved him.

I think Owens knows that, in the case of youngsters, what he is saying will not appeal to 99.9999% of even the ones who are patriotically-inclined, never mind youth in general. He's appealing to a rarefied category. While Nationalism must become a mass movement, its leaders will need special qualities.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy View Post
While his vlogging on movement disruption by the system are excellent his solutions for creating ethical nationalism in the UK without an existing structure will not work.If the British people were self starters capable of self education the current situation would never have happened in the first place.
I agree people on the whole aren't self-starters or autodidactic. For them, Owens' message is: 'Lead a normal life, get an education if you're that way inclined, do the best you can in your endeavours'. This is because 'normal'-type people will be of more use to us as sympathisers if they are successful, especially when placed within the system.

But for those who are determined to go into politics, Owens' message is start organising on a modest, local basis among your friends and associates. Most of us could do this. We'd be the leaders of whatever group it is, maybe 5 or 6 individuals in a locality. Those without any identifiable nationalist associations will be able to penetrate further than those who are known as the local 'racist', 'Nazi' or 'fascist', but even so, progress can be made if one is willing to learn about local issues and the way local government works.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy View Post
He needs an editor and advisor and needs to determine whether he is appealing to the movement or the masses they are not the same thing.
It seems to me that he is appealing to a small audience. Relatively few will bother watching his videos. It's not the masses. It's nationalists and it's 'ordinary' people who are nationalistically- or patriotically-inclined and who stumble on his channel and need to be steered in the right direction.

The hope is that a young person who is looking for guidance sees his videos and takes his advice before they go down the wrong track.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy View Post
He has stated that he is appealing to the youth (so not the movement?) but keeps referring to historical movement activity which for good or ill mean nothing to millennials and are a negative failure to over 30's.
He is appealing to anybody of broadly the same politics, of any age or background, who is listening and who is willing to take his advice. The historic mistakes are relevant for all of us - but especially to youngsters, because we don't want a repeat of them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy View Post
He is to be commended for making his videos and running for office but he needs to review his recommendations to new people.
He has regularly stated the electorate are not interested in the Kalergi plan and similar movement ballocks. He should realise the same applies to Tyndall and Griffin in the minds of the electorate.The last two are even contentious in movement circles.
Tyndall's book could rightly be seen as the bible for British Nationalism. One needn't be a Tyndallite to see things that way. It's a book about Britain, the British and British Nationalism. It does its job. Yes, there are better movement books: Yockey's Imperium or Koehl's Faith of the Future being examples. But the problem with thinkers is that they have faults: Yockey, for instance, was only metaphysically racist and wanted a pan-European nation-state. Tyndall, in contrast, had flaws as a politician, but he wrote just the right book at the right time and it serves its purpose and no more than that.

I agree Owens shouldn't keep appealing plaintively to Griffin, but to be fair: is there an alternative?

Last edited by Tom Rogers; 5 Days Ago at 07:05 AM.
 
Old 5 Days Ago #47
andy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Rogers View Post
The book recommendation and the advice about forming ad hoc committees were in the same video. I think he is aiming his advice at both types of people, but especially at people who do not have a background in nationalism, as that will allow them to appear as 'new faces'.

He did go into his own wayward youth, but he explained how political nationalism (as opposed to Robinson-style activism) saved him.

I think Owens knows that, in the case of youngsters, what he is saying will not appeal to 99.9999% of even the ones who are patriotically-inclined, never mind youth in general. He's appealing to a rarefied category. While Nationalism must become a mass movement, its leaders will need special qualities.



I agree people on the whole aren't self-starters or autodidactic. For them, Owens' message is: 'Lead a normal life, get an education if you're that way inclined, do the best you can in your endeavours'. This is because 'normal'-type people will be of more use to us as sympathisers if they are successful, especially when placed within the system.

But for those who are determined to go into politics, Owens' message is start organising on a modest, local basis among your friends and associates. Most of us could do this. We'd be the leaders of whatever group it is, maybe 5 or 6 individuals in a locality. Those without any identifiable nationalist associations will be able to penetrate further than those who are known as the local 'racist', 'Nazi' or 'fascist', but even so, progress can be made if one is willing to learn about local issues and the way local government works.



It seems to me that he is appealing to a small audience. Relatively few will bother watching his videos. It's not the masses. It's nationalists and it's 'ordinary' people who are nationalistically- or patriotically-inclined and who stumble on his channel and need to be steered in the right direction.

The hope is that a young person who is looking for guidance sees his videos and takes his advice before they go down the wrong track.



He is appealing to anybody of broadly the same politics, of any age or background, who is listening and who is willing to take his advice. The historic mistakes are relevant for all of us - but especially to youngsters, because we don't want a repeat of them.



Tyndall's book could rightly be seen as the bible for British Nationalism. One needn't be a Tyndallite to see things that way. It's a book about Britain, the British and British Nationalism. It does its job. Yes, there are better movement books: Yockey's Imperium or Koehl's Faith of the Future being examples. But the problem with thinkers is that they have faults: Yockey, for instance, was only metaphysically racist and wanted a pan-European nation-state. Tyndall, in contrast, had flaws as a politician, but he wrote just the right book at the right time and it serves its purpose and no more than that.

I agree Owens shouldn't keep appealing plaintively to Griffin, but to be fair: is there an alternative?
I thought it was out of date when it was published in 1988 it is now 2018.If it's purpose is to inform people about Tyndall then yes it serves it's purpose if it is to espouse a political philosophy suitable for application in 2018 then it does not.
To recommend it to anyone outside of the movement is the mark of the bogus and the crackpots.
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Old 5 Days Ago #48
Tom Rogers
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I thought it was out of date when it was published in 1988 it is now 2018.If it's purpose is to inform people about Tyndall then yes it serves it's purpose if it is to espouse a political philosophy suitable for application in 2018 then it does not.
To recommend it to anyone outside of the movement is the mark of the bogus and the crackpots.
Of course we would do better to rely on up-to-date information and not afford undue reverence to books of the past. At the same time, we need a unifying set of ideas, a common understanding, a vision and a goal, even a mythos. All books need to be considered in context, but Tyndall's book covers the essentials of what it means to be a British ethno-nationalist and, in my opinion, the general points of the book remain relevant; and in my view, Tyndall was correct on most (but not all) the subjects he covered. I wouldn't personally have recommended the book - the thought would not have occurred to me - but I see no harm in it. It is not the mark of the bogus or crackpots, in my view. John Tyndall was not, in his mature years, either of those things, nor are people who read and like the book on its own merits.
 
Old 3 Days Ago #49
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Even Alex Jones didn't believe it Tommy Robinson's 'manager' uses false stats about Muslim inmates
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Old 2 Days Ago #50
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Great Britain: A Sudden Escalation
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Old 2 Days Ago #51
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Thanks alex r.
 
Old 2 Days Ago #52
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Thanks alex r.
It's a scandal that Robinson is lionized as a defender of free speech while Ursula Haverbeck has been forgotten.
That said Ursula Haverbeck has been badly advised by her legal team and her close "comrades" who in my opinion are happy to exploit the oppression of this elderly patriot for their own agenda which has nothing to do with saving the race.
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Last edited by andy; 2 Days Ago at 03:42 PM.
 
Old 2 Days Ago #53
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If Robinson has any WN supporters who are publicly protesting for him, they should hold signs with Ursula Haverbeck.
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