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Old October 3rd, 2012 #581
Henry.
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That means he [MacDonald] must not have fully understood the medical and scientific evidence that revisionists, including scientists like Rudolf Gerhard and Faurisson, have provided to refute the Holocaust myth
Whatever they've provided it hasn't worked has it?

You don't need to argue till we all disappear, about which way a gas chamber door opened or the height of a smoke-stack, when Jewish documents are available boasting at how they rigged the evidence and the trials.

The documents detailing the hoax are sitting in the archives and on my hard-drive. MacDonald can have them tonight if he's ready to go to work.

Incidentally, Faurisson is a linguist not a 'hard scientist' (as you've put it) and I've no idea who Rudolf Gerhard is.

Never heard of him

Last edited by Henry.; October 3rd, 2012 at 02:28 PM. Reason: Alter brackets
 
Old October 3rd, 2012 #582
Robin King
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Sorry, I meant Germar Rudolf.
 
Old October 3rd, 2012 #583
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... I've no idea who Rudolf Gerhard is.

Never heard of him
I think he was Hill's first cousin.
 
Old October 3rd, 2012 #584
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I think he was Hill's first cousin.
I thought it might be him.

He comes around quite often when you get to my age
 
Old October 3rd, 2012 #585
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Germar Rudolf would of made a great director of the IHR. The man is so productive, it is quite amazing. Instead we see the agonizing slow death of a once productive organization, under the indolent and lazy good for nothing Mark Weber.
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Old October 9th, 2012 #586
Robin King
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I read the Johnson article which is the subject of this thread, and now understand what he's talking about (though I didn't finish reading the whole of his article). Basically he's saying that because there's so much tendency for Whites to feel guilt that even if White Nationalists were successful in disproving the Holohoax lie, the Jews would find something else to make Whites guilty about. Therefore, he reasons, the best thing is to have a non-apologetic attitude about White Nationalism, and forget about the past, including Holocaust revisionism.

I find his argument ridiculous. Yes, revisionism has not been that successful as most WNs would like, especially considering it started in the 1940s.

However, things have changed a lot since then. There is the Internet for starters, a new medium where many of the people can be reached as never before.

The main reason for Holohoax revisionism not spreading as widely as it should have is that no effective single message about the Holohoax has been crafted and promoted by WNs as a body.

Compare this failure with the success of liberals in getting their messages out. They, as you have probably noticed, keep their messages to one line or one slogan. They apply the KISS principle = Keep it simple, stupid.

Let's look at some of their messages: "Race is a social construct." Of course, this is wrong, but it's easy enough for the dull-minded and lazy to accept at face value and repeat the message.

Another one is a little bit more sophisticated and is promoted by the liberals in academia: "There are wider variations within a race than there are variations between races. Therefore, there is no such thing as race."

Again, just one single meme. But highly effective.

And what about the Jews and the Holocaust message? They too have kept it simple, just sticking to the one line and repeating it over and over again: "Six million Jews died in the Holocaust."

Another person who is good at getting his message out and having people parrot it is Alex Jones.

"9/11 was an inside job."

Completely wrong as it is the Mossad Jews who did 9/11 and not the US government (too risky for them to have done 9/11 because of the potential for leaks, and besides, they're too incompetent to do something like that, and also lack a motive), but that is not the point here. The important thing is that he managed to make this message go viral.

There are lots of other messages that have come from the Alex Jones' camp (and nearly all of them disinformation too) that have spread successfully. There are two main reasons for his success in getting his followers to parrot his messages: one, he repeats the same lines over and over again, and two, he keeps the messages simple. The result is that he is able to 1. brainwash his followers into believing his lies and 2. he is now able to get his now brainwashed followers to evangelize his message and recruit more followers who will then parrot his message and thereby gain more converts, and so on.

There is nothing like that in WNism. If anything, WNists have been turning away potential converts instead of gaining them because the messages in the main have not been effective and even off-putting sometimes.

To reiterate, there is no single meme about the Holohoax that is being put forward consistently by WNists. So it's hard for the public to understand why the Holocaust is a hoax. You have to remember they have been brainwashed to believe the human fat soap story and the human lampshade tale. Not only that, but they have also seen grisly pictures of dead bodies in the trenches in the camps.

If WNists could come up with one simple meme that is enough to make people doubt the Holocaust story, and stick with it and repeat it everywhere, it would do a lot to destroy the myth of the Holocaust.

I suggest a meme like this: "Gassing was to kill typhus-causing lice, not Jews."

And just stick to that message. There's no need to go beyond that in my view. This will counter many of the tactics and arguments that Jews use, such as "All my relatives died in the camps."

Yes, it's possible they all died, but it could be due to typhus or similar disease, not necessarily due to gassing.

I suggest not going into arguments or explanations about ovens and the impossibility of cremating so many bodies in that short amount of time. The lay public don't understand concepts like those; it will just confuse them and turn them away from listening further.

But the typhus disease explanation is something the public CAN understand. It provides a rationale for Germans using gas in the camps—for fumigation of clothing and bedding—and does much to dispel the sinister associations people make between gassing and the camps.

If you have succeeded in getting your audience interested in listening further, you can then talk about the dead people in the pictures, and explain that they are skeletal in appearance, not because they had been starved or maltreated, but because they are showing the effects of typhus.

However, these are all optional extras. The main thing is to get your principal meme across. If you have been able to do that, you have made progress.

So, instead of abandoning Holohoax revisionism as Greg Johnson proposes, adopting a different approach to revisionism is the way to go IMO.

Being united in putting forward a simple message, containing a single meme, has not been tried yet in the case of Holohoax revisionism.

Greg Johnson spends too much in the ivory tower for him to be a good tactician. He is out of touch with the real world. He doesn't know how the public thinks. He doesn't interact with them. He doesn't know what's going on in the trenches. All you have to do is to have a glance at Occidental Observer to understand that Johnson is totally clueless about how to advance WNism with the public.

I mean, if you can't get the message across that the Holocaust is a fraud, something relatively simple to convey, then how on earth are you going to get the much more complicated message across that Whites should become White Nationalists and need to stop apologizing for being WNs?

The Holocaust myth is a big reason why people are not WNs in the first place.


But he doesn't understand that. He has his head stuck up his ass, and all he wants to do is gaze at his bowels all day long and talk endlessly on his blog about the state of his bowels, with an audience that also like to gaze at their bowels.
 
Old October 9th, 2012 #587
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin King View Post
The main reason for Holohoax revisionism not spreading as widely as it should have is that no effective single message about the Holohoax has been crafted and promoted by WNs as a body.
WNs, as a body, haven't promoted it enough yet, but you used the "effective single message" about a dozen times in your post: HOLOHOAX

Good work.

The replacement of the enemy's word-weapon with HOLOHOAX strikes the meme at ground zero. It puts the enemy on the defensive.

Make the believers justify themselves. Then laugh at them, and tell them that the gas was used to save human lives by killing typhus bearing lice, and the HOLOHOAX is a continuation of war by psychological means.
 
Old October 9th, 2012 #588
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THE HOLOHOAX- held together by six million lies.
 
Old October 9th, 2012 #589
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Yes, revisionism has not been that successful as most WNs would like, especially considering it started in the 1940s.
By what measurement does somebody claim that revisionism hasn’t accomplished much when people in positions of authority would never admit being influenced by it? Whatever influence revisionism has had will be largely untraceable.

I think it has had a lot of influence. It seemed to me, when Kofi Annan said at the Durban anti-racist conference in 2000 that the State of Israel should stop using the Holocaust as an excuse, that the fact that the veracity of the Holocaust story had been disputed for many years, with some arguments that are unassailable, very likely lay somewhere behind that statement.

There is a dialectical process that has to be taken into account. When somebody takes the extreme position that there was no Holocaust, others are influenced by that, whether they wish to be influenced or not. Some of them will then say, I am not a Holocaust denier but it does seem to me that there has been some exaggeration, or alternately, I am not a Holocaust-denier but the Jewish exploitation of that story is over the top — which is what the Secretary-General of the United Nations effectively said.

Look at all the Google hits for “I am not a Holocaust-denier but”: 6620 hits for that exact combination of words in the English language.

These people are able to speak more freely because there are “Holocaust-deniers” that have taken the extreme position. That is a major part of the influence of revisionism.

Extreme positions, insofar as they carry any credibility at all, define the limits of discourse. Shocking and upsetting people is part of the dialectical process. This is why it’s wrong to try to cater to people’s sensitivities at the expense of facts and logic (the basis of credibility) as Greggy Johnson advocates, and as Mark Weber has been practicing for some years now.
 
Old October 9th, 2012 #590
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There is a dialectical process that has to be taken into account. When somebody takes the extreme position that there was no Holocaust
Totally.

Re-labeling the Holohoax is an "Overturn Window" strategy
 
Old October 9th, 2012 #591
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There must be zero tolerance of the Holocaust narrative...ZERO TOLERANCE.

Nothing else will do.

Germar Rudolph's name has been mentioned by a number of posters here but I have to point out that he is not a white nationalist and certainly not an apologist or supporter of national-socialism. He made his position very clear some months ago in an interview with David Duke that's still available on the Jeff Rense site.

It's obvious that Rudolph is not interested in the question of racial nationalism: something vitally important to us. So if anyone thinks he is a potential leader, they can forget it.

Perhaps one day he'll change mind.
 
Old October 9th, 2012 #592
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Originally Posted by Henry. View Post
There must be zero tolerance of the Holocaust narrative...ZERO TOLERANCE.

Nothing else will do.

Germar Rudolph's name has been mentioned by a number of posters here but I have to point out that he is not a white nationalist and certainly not an apologist or supporter of national-socialism. He made his position very clear some months ago in an interview with David Duke that's still available on the Jeff Rense site.

It's obvious that Rudolph is not interested in the question of racial nationalism: something vitally important to us. So if anyone thinks he is a potential leader, they can forget it.

Perhaps one day he'll change mind.
Can you provide a link to the specific one?
 
Old October 9th, 2012 #593
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Originally Posted by Solskeniskyn View Post
Can you provide a link to the specific one?
Rudolf also made it clear in his interview with Carolyn Yeager that he is essentially an honest liberal (in the European sense). This is not an unusual path to historical revisionism. Anybody that is sensitive to hypocrisy is ripe, first for protecting the free speech of revisionists, then for accepting that there are serious problems with the Holocaust story, and in some cases eventually for recognizing the merits of national-socialism.

There are MANY revisionists that are not any kind of nationalist. Some have been Marxists or Muslims or even in a very few cases, Jews. This only tends to validate that revisionism represents truth regardless of political orientation. Even non-Whites can be interested in the truth. It does not detract from the utility of revisionism for nationalism.

Last edited by Hadding; October 9th, 2012 at 05:33 PM.
 
Old October 9th, 2012 #594
Henry.
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Originally Posted by Solskeniskyn View Post
Can you provide a link to the specific one?
Unless it's been removed or omitted, you'll find it here:
http://www.renseradioarchives.com/dduke/
 
Old October 9th, 2012 #595
Henry.
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Anybody that is sensitive to hypocrisy is ripe, first for protecting the free speech of revisionists, then for accepting that there are serious problems with the Holocaust story, and in some cases eventually for recognizing the merits of national-socialism.
Yes. Rudolph's qualities are obvious and powerful and hopefully he'll come to see the truth in its entirety.
 
Old October 9th, 2012 #596
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Took a lot of guts for Germar to do this interview. I'm not sure what his gag order is in Germany, but I bet it is draconian.

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Date: 08-27-12

Rebroadcast of 04-30-12


Dr. Duke and Germar Rudolf discuss free speech and political persecution in Europe and the need for the protection of these basic human rights. Mr. Rudolf tells his story of imprisonment for scientific inquiry in nations that pride themselves on "freedom of speech."
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Old October 9th, 2012 #597
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Took a lot of guts for Germar to do this interview. I'm not sure what his gag order is in Germany, but I bet it is draconian.
It's risible how active terrorists like Nelson Mandela are revered by whites while pacific but honest intellectuals like Germar Rudolf are reviled and targeted for destruction.

There should a street named after him in every city of every nation.
 
Old October 9th, 2012 #599
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I think Germar is closer to us than you realize. Looks like he has made camp in the UK for now, until he can resolve his 'immigration situation' regarding Uncle Sam's refusal (so far) to allow him entry to the United States to be with his wife and child.
I don't think so.

He did 3 or 4 interviews with Duke, not just the one you posted.

As with MacDonald, one should take Rudolph at his word. Trying to extrapolate from what's not there is a form of projection and wishful thinking.

As someone who once pounded the streets for Nick Griffin surely you must understand that.

In his interview with Carolyn Yeager, Germar Rudolph said that Hitler should have returned Germany to a democracy in 1938: If that's what he really thinks then he's actually further from us than you realize.

Last edited by Henry.; October 9th, 2012 at 08:25 PM.
 
Old October 9th, 2012 #600
James Hawthorne
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Germar Rudolf is back in the United States, reporting on his website that he is living with his wife somewhere in Pennsylvania. He had kept a low profile for a while as he wrangled out legal complications preventing him from residing in the US.
This is good news.
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