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Old December 25th, 2017 #41
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Originally Posted by Olaf Menes View Post
On one note all Earth Religions would be rendered Obsolete if they said "Ya, we made you from apes 100,000 years ago, we came back today to see how our children are".

No doubt I would ask this, What would people on this forum ask Aliens if they were granted one question to pose to a species that had possibly traveled to hundreds of worlds?
I would ask them if they found evidence that the universe is being governed by an intelligently driven force? We don't know enough to make that determination, but maybe they do.
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Old January 1st, 2018 #42
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Old January 1st, 2018 #43
Olaf Menes
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I would ask them if they found evidence that the universe is being governed by an intelligently driven force? We don't know enough to make that determination, but maybe they do.

It may be that time is the real barrier to contact with aliens. After all, Humans as a species have only existed in a intelligent, self determination state for around 12,000 years, and in what could be considered technological degree with extremely primitive space travel for 50 years......a minute sliver of time on a cosmological scale.

We may as well be primordial sludge crawling onto land 4 billion years ago, as far as what level of technology is needed to find a new interstellar world to colonize.
 
Old January 4th, 2018 #44
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Our solar system and planet Earth are at least 4 billion years old, long enough for other civilizations in the galaxy that may have arisen to have noticed its existence and detected the oxygen and liquid water that as far as we humans know is necessary in the development of life. ETs may have known about us for a very long time now, but we probably are much too primitive to even bother with at this point.
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Old January 5th, 2018 #45
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This is some of the most retarded shit I've ever heard:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyson_sphere

This would probably require all the mineral resources from dozens of systems. And take millions of years to build. This is pure fantasy, yet some scientists think this is a real possibility. Any civilization capable of such an engineering feat, would have to be an interstellar civilization, and would have most definitely came up with more viable, alternative energy sources, and they wouldn't need something as crude and costly as a 'Dyson sphere'.
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Old January 6th, 2018 #46
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Constructing a Dyson sphere probably would be ludicrous when you look at all the problems involved with our current state of technology and understanding of physics. KIC8462852, also known as Boyajian's Star has had many unusual dimming and brightening events observed over the years, leading many scientists to speculate if this is evidence of some alien mega-structure like a Dyson sphere or Dyson swarm being built around the star or natural phenomena like dust or dust rings circling Boyajian's Star. Hopefully we can get better data on this soon with Earth and space-based telescopes.

Using Star Trek once again as speculation (TNG episode 'Relics', the one that brought back Scotty), it would be mind-blowing if an actual Dyson sphere really were discovered out there someday.

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Old January 6th, 2018 #47
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Originally Posted by Ray Allan View Post

Voyager 1/2 plaque and golden record 'Sounds of Earth.'

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The following music was included on the Voyager record.


Bach, Brandenburg Concerto No. 2 in F. First Movement, Munich Bach Orchestra, Karl Richter, conductor. 4:40

Java, court gamelan, "Kinds of Flowers," recorded by Robert Brown. 4:43

Senegal, percussion, recorded by Charles Duvelle. 2:08

Zaire, Pygmy girls' initiation song, recorded by Colin Turnbull. 0:56

Australia, Aborigine songs, "Morning Star" and "Devil Bird," recorded by Sandra LeBrun Holmes. 1:26

Mexico, "El Cascabel," performed by Lorenzo Barcelata and the Mariachi México. 3:14

"Johnny B. Goode," written and performed by Chuck Berry. 2:38

New Guinea, men's house song, recorded by Robert MacLennan. 1:20

Japan, shakuhachi, "Tsuru No Sugomori" ("Crane's Nest,") performed by Goro Yamaguchi. 4:51

Bach, "Gavotte en rondeaux" from the Partita No. 3 in E major for Violin, performed by Arthur Grumiaux. 2:55

Mozart, The Magic Flute, Queen of the Night aria, no. 14. Edda Moser, soprano. Bavarian State Opera, Munich, Wolfgang Sawallisch, conductor. 2:55

Georgian S.S.R., chorus, "Tchakrulo," collected by Radio Moscow. 2:18

Peru, panpipes and drum, collected by Casa de la Cultura, Lima. 0:52

"Melancholy Blues," performed by Louis Armstrong and his Hot Seven. 3:05

Azerbaijan S.S.R., bagpipes, recorded by Radio Moscow. 2:30

Stravinsky, Rite of Spring, Sacrificial Dance, Columbia Symphony Orchestra, Igor Stravinsky, conductor. 4:35

Bach, The Well-Tempered Clavier, Book 2, Prelude and Fugue in C, No.1. Glenn Gould, piano. 4:48

Beethoven, Fifth Symphony, First Movement, the Philharmonia Orchestra, Otto Klemperer, conductor. 7:20

Bulgaria, "Izlel je Delyo Hagdutin," sung by Valya Balkanska. 4:59

Navajo Indians, Night Chant, recorded by Willard Rhodes. 0:57

Holborne, Paueans, Galliards, Almains and Other Short Aeirs, "The Fairie
Round," performed by David Munrow and the Early Music Consort of London. 1:17

Solomon Islands, panpipes, collected by the Solomon Islands Broadcasting Service. 1:12

Peru, wedding song, recorded by John Cohen. 0:38

China, ch'in, "Flowing Streams," performed by Kuan P'ing-hu. 7:37

India, raga, "Jaat Kahan Ho," sung by Surshri Kesar Bai Kerkar. 3:30

"Dark Was the Night," written and performed by Blind Willie Johnson. 3:15

Beethoven, String Quartet No. 13 in B flat, Opus 130, Cavatina, performed by Budapest String Quartet. 6:37

https://voyager.jpl.nasa.gov/golden-...-record/music/
------

Aliens probably heard it and thought "F**k that noise".
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Old January 6th, 2018 #48
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would have most definitely came up with more viable, alternative energy sources,
You'd think, but they could (much like us humans with oil and nuclear energy) be enslaved to it by a powerful 'Dyson sphere cartel'.
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Old January 6th, 2018 #49
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You'd think, but they could (much like us humans with oil and nuclear energy) be enslaved to it by a powerful 'Dyson sphere cartel'.
Almost with certainty,any Alien Species with the ability of interstellar, or even intergalactic travel capabilities would be able to harness power sources humans would probably not even be able to comprehend.

It would have to be close to infinite, indefatigable power sources.

Even so, Time factors may even be at play, since if such methods were even in use by many Alien Species.....Earth would be a busy space port like popeyes parking lot in the ghetto on sell EBT card night.
 
Old January 6th, 2018 #50
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A Dyson Sphere is ridiculous, even a Dyson "Swarm" doesn't make sense if by it you imagine multiple planes of orbital trajectories. What makes the most sense is a Dyson "Plane", a single plane in which "habitats" would orbit in circular orbits around the Sun (powered by the solar panels and largely self-sufficient).

The habs would be cylindrical, about 1km in radius and oriented perpendicular to the Dyson Plane, and ultimately up to millions of kilometers long, each hab consisting of thousands of individual "eco-tubes", each eco-tube being encapsulated from its neighbors in case of a breach or quarantine. Each eco-tube houses a unique eco-system.

The inhabitants of an eco-system will have to evolve to thrive in very low-gravity enivironments, as the gravity (generated by rotation) at the inside surface of the eco-tubes is perhaps around one-one hundredth Earth's gravity. At these levels of gravity, folks can easily fly around and construct super-tall buildings without undue structural stresses. Also it could be that there are longevity bonuses for creatures that adapt to life in low-g environments, which might be an incentive for folks to want to live in habs.

But I think the main incentive will be population pressures and desire to expand out from Earth, especially if there is war and strife on the planet.

First we need to colonize the Moon. Here we start building up the colony using "drone-bots", drones that are controlled by people living on Earth using "Virtual Reality" devices that emulate the "reality" of the drones (so you can see through a drone's eyes, and manipulate their bodies and hands using a special suit and gloves that detects your movement). The drones can very efficiently build up mining and manufacturing facilities on the Moon since they don't need to breathe or eat, and aren't affected so much by radiation; also they can work 24/7. Once the drones have built up infrastructure and habs for people to live in, people can begin to populate the Moon in earnest.

Mars will be harder to colonize using drone-bots due to latency issues (where it only takes a second for information to go from Earth to Mars, it takes minutes to communicate with drones on Mars). But eventually we will need to establish colonies on Mars and many other places, in order to extract materials for building habs that orbit the Sun.

The habs will generally orbit in the space between Mercury and the Asteroid Belt, between 50 and 250 million km from the Sun; later on, when we run out of space and start mining the Jovian planets for materials, hab-space can extend much farther out, although these outer habs won't receive nearly as much sunlight. But the initial planets and moons that can be mined include:
-Titan (moon of Saturn)
-Galilean Moons of Jupiter (Io, Europa, Ganymede, Callisto)
-Asteroid Belt (although this will be mined out quickly since it doesn't contain much mass)
-Mars (if we decide we can't terraform it sufficiently)
-Venus (this will perhaps be the most difficult to extract resources from, but it has more resources than all the other sources combined, excluding the Jovian planets which are mostly hydrogen and helium, and would be even more difficult to mine than Venus)
-Mercury (also difficult to mine, but good source of iron)

Later on, in a few thousand years, or less depending on how fast things proceed, perhaps we'll have the technology to start mining the Jovian planets, which is where the vast bulk of mass in the solar system is located, and convert hydrogen that we don't need into heavier elements that we do.

In all, I see that using a Dyson Plane paradigm of very long habs (up to millions, or even tens of millions of km long), and exploiting the non-Jovian matter in our solar system, we can use a few percent, perhaps up to 10 percent in the most ambitious scenario, of the Sun's power. I don't know if we'll ever get to using near 100% of the Sun's power, but even just a few percent is the equivalent of tens of millions of Earths.

Imagine having the equivalent of tens of millions of Earths in the solar system.

By the way, the habs use active "spools" (magnetically levitated electro-magnetic motors) and tethers to receive and send payloads (which are drone ships powered by plasma thrusters), which is why habs need to be long, skinny cylinders. There is perhaps a spool every km or so along a hab, and a tether (carbon nanotube) of thousands of km with a "catcher" on the end catches payloads and slows them over thousands of km, before stopping them and reeling them in.
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Old January 6th, 2018 #51
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A Dyson Sphere is ridiculous, even a Dyson "Swarm" doesn't make sense if by it you imagine multiple planes of orbital trajectories. What makes the most sense is a Dyson "Plane", a single plane in which "habitats" would orbit in circular orbits around the Sun (powered by the solar panels and largely self-sufficient).
Artificial satellites could do that. Anyone advanced enough to build an artifical satellite large enough to house thousands or millions would possess superior energy technology to solar. Solar is a primitive energy source. Nuclear fusion is the next step up for humans as a viable energy source.

https://newsroom.unsw.edu.au/news/sc...2%80%99-energy

The only way I could see solar being viable as a supplimentary energy source, is if someone could create structures with solar cells built in. We're not talking about something as unyieldy as 'solar panels'. Like for example, you got a skyscraper, and every part of the exterior of the structure, including the windows, is capable of drawing solar energy. I'm talking about doing it in a way that doesn't dumb down the aesthetics of the design for solar power.
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Last edited by Crowe; January 6th, 2018 at 02:28 PM.
 
Old January 6th, 2018 #52
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Artificial satellites could do that. Anyone advanced enough to build an artifical satellite large enough to house thousands or millions would possess superior energy technology to solar. Solar is a primitive energy source. Nuclear fusion is the next step up for humans as a viable energy source.

https://newsroom.unsw.edu.au/news/sc...2%80%99-energy

The only way I could see solar being viable as a supplimentary energy source, is if someone could create structures with solar cells built in. We're not talking about something as unyieldy as 'solar panels'. Like for example, you got a skyscraper, and every part of the exterior of the structure, including the windows, is capable of drawing solar energy. I'm talking about doing it in a way that doesn't dumb down the aesthetics of the design for solar power.
Fusion is a great power source, it's what powers the Sun (the Sun is just a giant fusion reactor), and I'm hopeful we'll have viable fusion reactor technology soon, although there's no guarantee. Solar power in and of itself isn't primitive, what's primitive are the solar cells we use to convert the sunlight to electricity. If we could develop solar cells that were near 100 percent efficient, lasted a long time, and were easy to manufacture and recycle, solar power wouldn't be primitive at all. Also realize in space solar is consistent, dependable, and quite strong (a football field receives about 5 MW of power in space at Earth's distance from Sun, and the power density is four times greater twice as close to the Sun).

But on Earth, fusion power would probably always be economically superior to solar due to the inconsistency and unreliablity of solar.
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Last edited by George Witzgall; January 6th, 2018 at 04:54 PM.
 
Old January 6th, 2018 #53
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Nobody has even given Tesla's idea of drawing electrical energy from Earth's atmosphere a serious 2nd look. It's possible he was 200, or 300 years ahead of his time. This wasn't from some random crackpot, but from one of the brightest minds in history.

The cynic in me says that they shot down Tesla's idea, simply because they couldn't figure out a way to capitalize off of it. Tesla wasn't of the jewy mindset that someone needs to be able to make a profit from everything, or that any potential resource should be leveraged as a mechanism for controlling the masses. And some of Tesla's work, to this day, still remains classified by the government.
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Old February 11th, 2018 #54
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On the other hand, we may already be part of some intra-galactic zoo.
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Old February 14th, 2018 #55
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Old February 17th, 2018 #56
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Default Will aliens find Elon Musk's space car?

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Old March 2nd, 2018 #57
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Default Where are the aliens?

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Old April 29th, 2018 #58
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Old 2 Weeks Ago #59
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Default Maybe everyone else in the galaxy is still in the Stone Age?

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Old 6 Days Ago #60
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Default Tabby's Star continues to baffle astronomers

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