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November 26th, 2012 | #1 |
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#1 Catalonia Thread
Catalonia election: Separatists win majority
Voters in Spain's Catalonia region have given a majority to parties seeking Catalan independence. However, Catalan President Artur Mas, who called the early election and pushed for independence, lost seats. His centre-right CiU remains the largest bloc, winning 50 seats out of 135, down from 62 last time. The left-wing separatist ERC won 21 seats. But a BBC correspondent says despite their combined majority, the parties may be unable to work together. Both the CiU and ERC want to hold a referendum on independence from Spain. A source close to a "disappointed" Catalan President Artur Mas told me a referendum, or at least a public consultation on independence, is "still the plan". Crucially, my source believes a deal with Esquerra Republicana, the centre-left pro-independence party which increased its share of the vote last night, "has to be possible" as there is "no other alternative". However a pact between CiU - Mr Mas's centre-right nationalist coalition - and Esquerra Republicana will not be easy. The two are poles apart on the crucial issue of the economy and how to tackle the economic crisis in Catalonia. CiU has implemented austerity measures, including controversial cuts to the public sector. It is possible it will want to implement more economic reforms, which Esquerra Republicana is likely to oppose. My sense therefore is that, following last night's election result, a referendum on independence from Spain is less likely, because of the fact that the political process going forward has become even more complicated than it was before. Bittersweet victory Mr Mas told the BBC he would consult the people on independence within the next four years. "I am happy with tonight's results," he said, "but not as happy as I could have been." Mr Mas called early elections after a funding row with the central government in Madrid. It has accused him of trying to exploit the economic crisis, saying Catalan nationalists were looking for excuses after nearly running out of money. European membership? Mr Mas says the wealthy and influential north-eastern region gets a raw funding deal from the central government. His centre-right Catalan nationalist coalition (CiU) argues a Catalan state would fare better as a member of the EU than a province of Spain. The European flag was prominent at Mr Mas's campaign rallies, and he says an independent Catalonia would quickly gain membership of the 27-member bloc. However, the Esquerra Republicana de Catalunya (ERC), the Republican Left party, has more than doubled its previous share of seats - up from 10 in 2010 to 21 this time. That has been seen partly as a reaction to Mr Mas's resort to austerity measures to fight Catalonia's debt. CiU and the ERC have very different views of how to address the economic crisis, says the BBC's Tom Burridge, in the Catalan regional capital Barcelona. The result may actually mean a referendum on independence from Spain is therefore less likely, because the political process has become even more complicated, our correspondent says. It was already far from straightforward, he says. A referendum would be illegal under the current Spanish constitution, and Spain's ruling Popular Party is likely to block any attempts for constitutional change. Other parties, such as the Ciutadans, the Popular Party of Catalonia and the Socialist Party of Catalonia are all opposed to Catalonia's independence bid. Are you in Catalonia? What is your reaction to the election result? Who did you vote for? What do you think about the issue of independence? You can send us your views using the form below. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-20482719 |
November 26th, 2012 | #2 |
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Not that I am against the Catalans but these independence movements are all pro EU. Seen it with Montenegro and Scotland where the most fervent supporters of the break up of Serbia and the UK were/are the most extreme leftists. Not saying that the loyalists are much better but these people are even worse.
In any case I see nothing here worth getting too excited over. If they do secede they will be just another EU member puppet state with the same liberalism that Spain has. These secession movements are certainly not opposed by the EU, unlike the Bosnian Serb one which has been crushed by military force and foreign occupation. EU flags dominate at every Catalan independence rally.
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November 26th, 2012 | #3 |
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I've been to Catalonia. The entire region was a hotbed of anarchist activity (via the CNT-FAI) during the Spanish Civil War. They share some of the same opposition to Castilian ethno-cultural supremacy that the Basques do, the type that saw their own distinct culture repressed under General Franco's regime.
It's similar to many Latin American social justice movements too. Catalans probably wouldn't be enthusiastic supporters of white supremacist movements, and their fictional elements of European cultural unity. |
November 26th, 2012 | #4 |
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Spain leaving the EU would be much more interesting from a WN perspective than Catalonia leaving Spain.
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November 27th, 2012 | #5 |
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Would Catalonia be included in the EU or would they have to apply for membership? Don't know how that would work.
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November 27th, 2012 | #6 | |
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November 27th, 2012 | #7 |
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Most of the parties in Catalonia are racist and nationalist. They have about 16,000 sikhs who know the time for being shipped home approaches. Nationalism is exploding in Europe as economies rapidly deteriorate. White lefties are coming to reason as well. Inferior turdskins and stinky mooslims are done for.
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November 27th, 2012 | #8 | |
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And I think the centre of Spanish anarchism was Andalucia. Last edited by Ian; November 27th, 2012 at 07:49 PM. |
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December 9th, 2012 | #9 | |
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December 10th, 2012 | #10 | ||
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False. Both regions were anarchist strongholds, but Catalonia and its capital of Barcelona were the hub of Spanish anarchism during the civil war.
Here is Antony Beevor's description in The Spanish Civil War. Quote:
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December 10th, 2012 | #11 | ||
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False. Both regions were anarchist strongholds, but Catalonia and its capital of Barcelona were the hub of Spanish anarchism during the civil war.
Here is Antony Beevor's description in The Spanish Civil War. Quote:
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December 10th, 2012 | #12 | |
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The description of Republican Barcelona includes Communist activity. Orwell did not go to Andalucia, which was captured early on by the Nationalists. The society of Andalucia was very different from Catalonia. In my estimation there was more Anarchist aspirations among the Andalusian peasants than Communist mentality Catalan workers. Spanish Communism was of the Russian city-industrial type, not the Chinese peasant army. |
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December 10th, 2012 | #13 |
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I think secession of the Catalans only benefits the globalists, breaking Europe up into even smaller pieces means less of a threat of compettition on the world stage. It's all kitsch to them, tomorrow Catalan becomes its own nation and everything will be exactly the same as it is today, only their smaller size will make them even more vulnerable to international money predators.
On a side note, that Valdez guy is a fucking eyesore. I'm not a bigot and wouldn't have any problem allowing an authentic Amerindian nationalist posting here (like DeShawn here, who is a true ethnic nationalist that I can respect), but this guy is just another campus commie in American Eagle mocassins whose historical outlook is forged by the Jew Howard Zinn, not any real Indians. "Smash the Fash"? Adolf Hitler and the Nationalsocialists actually gave money to American Indian organizations, even romanticized certain red indians as great warriors like the Sioux's (from a "Nazi" newspaper Der Pimpf 1938): My curiosity on Valdez, if he is so proud to be an injun, why are all his ideologues Jewish? Why are all his enemies the same enemies of the Jew? Why is he attacking the whites, the Nationalsocialists, when it's the Jews that destroyed his people's virility with Converso trafficked carribean rum ? Instead, Valdez the wannabe indian shabbos goy, would rather just be a pawn in the mindless brown bloc Jews manipulate against the people who get in pan-judea's way. |
December 10th, 2012 | #14 | ||
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I agree with this post from JoeOfGDNY Quote:
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December 11th, 2012 | #15 |
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Interesting Joe. Hunter Wallace of Occidental Dissent and his commentators said Catalan's succession broke free of the Jewish stranglehold and stands like a knight against the impending globalism. Wallace seemed delibrately leaving out the fact that this seccession movement as, Serbian mentioned, is very EU and liberal, while OD is the place supposedly for the relentless domination of antebellum yore that Southern slavery defined of white supremacy.
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December 11th, 2012 | #16 | |
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Abel Paz wrote of Barcelona in Durruti: The People Armed that, "Industry is in the hands of the workers and all the production centers conspicuously fly the red and black flags as well as inscriptions announcing that they have really become collectives. The revolution seems to be universal." Here's a direct link to Beevor's account that I already quoted from so that you can read it for yourself: "The collectives in republican Spain were not like the state collectives of the Soviet Union. They were based on the joint ownership and management of the land or factory...The regions most affected were Catalonia and Aragon, where about 70 percent of the workforce was involved." There's an entire e-book called The Anarchist Collectives that you can read if you want to know more accurate information about this social revolution and less inaccurate stereotypes, and nonsense like confusing Chinese-style Maoism with anarchism. |
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December 11th, 2012 | #17 | |||
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I'm not an "Amerindian nationalist" either; I don't believe in ethnic nationalism, as I believe in unity among all workers of the world. I just played the part of an ethnic nationalist here on the forum in order to feed you fascists your own medicine in reverse, so that you'd come to understand the implications of consistently applying your own "separatist" principles, i.e. Europeans go back to Europe. Quote:
Aside from his ignorance of geography (Central America is part of North America), he also seemed to be ignorant of the fact that there are enormous disparities in the proportions of European and Amerindian admixture in the peoples of Central and South America. Quote:
What's "wannabe Indian" about me? |
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December 11th, 2012 | #18 | |
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It was a strange comment coming from any poster, because most of us here are individual commentators, not part of some hierarchy that dictates what we should or should not post. It's been a while, but the post is here somewhere. If you want to fuck with him (I'm sure you do). Start asking him about indigenous Palestinians and what should be done with the kikes that are occupying Palestine. It throws him into a tizzy, as he's theoretically supportive of indigenous peoples, except when it comes to that part of the world. Shows his hypocrisy in its full-bloom state.
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December 11th, 2012 | #19 | |||||||
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Hopefully a moderator can split this into another thread
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What Left-wing forum can someone like me post on, Chief? I don't pretend I am anti-authoritarian. I support it to break up Jewish nepotism and counter the abtuse insanities they promote in their monopoly media, monopoly academia, etc, that you lap up in your brown self-esteem college class. Anarchists are the ones who claim to be anti-authoritarian, yet they respond to dissent from the Cultural Marxist dogma that has united you to big Jew capital with violence. You, in fact, are the street soldiers of the system Quote:
The reality? Whites fought amongst each other in the new world as much as they did fight the Indians. Look up the French-Indian wars and various alliances French, Spaniards, British, Dutch, etc had with various Indian tribes. Some of the Indians of the America's vanished for the sheer fact that the racial demographic change. While it's true many Indians died due to European disease (not our fault, blame nature), countless Europeans also died from various diseases, including the Indian disease of Syphillis. If you understood that race=culture, you would realize that if there are 3 whites for every 1 Indian, European culture is going to predominate. People bring culture in their genes. I don't see why making up an alternate reality is going to help advance your race in any way (but it sure does advance the Jewish race). Quote:
When we're ethnic nationalists, we're evil racists. When you're an ethnic nationalist, it's fair game. What a "principle" Quote:
Hitler romanticized American frontier culture, due to his love of Karl May books and Westerns. Indians by and large were portrayed positively in German culture of the Third Reich due to Karl May's influence, Sioux indians were made "honorary Aryans" for example. The Nationalsocialists weren't cut and dry "white supremacists" like you want them to be. They for the most part, gave everyone their due credit. The fact is, some Indians were brave warriors who utilized their means to superhuman potential, but in the end they crumbled beneath the Aryan will. The indians fought like barbarians, taking no quarters and cutting out the fetuses out of pregnant womens stomach, just because Europeans responded in kind and your guys lost , doesn't mean you get any moral superiority over us. That doesn't mean I want to meddle in the affairs of Indians, or undermine them by force, I believe all people have a right to a homeland, but nature and history picked a winner and it wasn't you. This is an objective, unattached view, it's only been constructed as "racist" by modern Jew sociologists and Boasian anthropologists who seek to make up an alternate reality. Jews created the cult of the loser, by latching on to the "white power structure" Bizarro reality instead of working to better yourselves today away from Jew cosmopolitanism, you attack your own people's pride. Quote:
Hitler also believed that America is a mongrelized shithole, half-way between negro and Jewish, later in his life. Quote:
The concern isn't whether some European has an Arab or Hunnic or Lappish ancestor from long, the concern is about preserving the genetically passed down character traits (primarily, but also physical secondary) that made the West what it was. That Faustian spirit, unique to Aryans, the knowledge that even though you strive for transcendental utopia you will always fall short of this and work towards it anyway, this is a genetic trait most common in Europeans, and one that has laid dormant for hundreds of years in the current Jewish money dictatorship. We want to free ourselves so we can create new ideas and revolutionize man once again, instead of staying stagnant and retarded in the current environment. Strangely enough, Valdez (nice Sephardic name by the way! ), you don't seem to question Southern European admixture when you blame the white Spaniards of 1492 for the reason why your people are so fucked up today. Quote:
Even original, gentile Anarchist theorists like Proudhon and Bakunin (who at the internationales used to call Karl Marx a filthy Jew, in response to Marx calling him a degenerate queer!) would laugh at your views. Jews create the delusions and you fight the wars for them, against us. You don't understand that if we free the world from Juda's clutch, the Indians will benefit too, as your people too will be free of all the moral degradation and spiritual decay the Jew pushes. The Indians of Peru, Bolivia, etc will be free from exploitive, globalist Jew mineral speculators like George Soros, whose agenda you indirectly promote. But in reality, Valdez, you're not interested in bettering your own race. You're interested in masturbating to white women, drinking the fire water, and getting lots of pats on the back from moneyed Jewish social engineers for throwing your feces at white people. You're probably also fat fuck and mostly white, as most modern North American indians are. You do nothing but try and stifle my people's right to self-determination, to keep Jews in power. Here is an example of an Indian whose really got his people's interests in mind: |
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December 11th, 2012 | #20 | |
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This seems to always give Leftists a problem. People like Valdez aren't interested in genuine principles or ideas that are truly outside the box. He might call himself an Anarchist, or whatever other brand of 21st century store-bought Kosher rebellion, but in the end he's more concerned about being labeled homophobic or anti-semite by his bourgeois associates and Jewish benefactors than he is about telling the truth. The type of person who tells white people to go back to Europe, and not denounce the existence of Jews in Palestine is an opportunist simply trying to get ahead in the rat race. |
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#1, catalan, catalonia, independence movements, secession, spain |
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