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Old September 21st, 2004 #41
Anima Eternae
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MOMUS
Some greeks were nordics, thus it is presumptuous and flatly wrong to say "greeks were never nordic."
Greeks were not Nordic. Not in the population sense. Exception is not the rule.


Quote:
BTW, I never heard your views on the Joe Vials story about Mossad's role in the Russian school slaughter. Did you find it interesting? Are you allowed to discuss it?
Link?



...
 
Old September 21st, 2004 #42
MOMUS
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No boobage at all and hard as a piece of wood. After she is through with this she may gain some womanly attributes.
She is pretty and admirable but not sexy at all to me.

You remind me of a skit from an old national lampoon record album. Two sports commentators are breathlessly describing a gymnastic floor event of a cute little Romanian gymnast at the Olympics in Bugerglob, Yug. The female announcer murmurs something like, " her pert little nipples are standing erect as she prepares for her run," then shouts about the event," a running start and then a double flip! A flick-flack! A triple gainer!" etc.
The male announcer blurts out, "Boy, I'd like to fuck her!"
Well, it would be funny if you heard it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bragi
I fell in love with Catalina Polor during the summer olympics. She's a Romanian, not a Greek. This girl is my idea of perfection. Wow, what a hottie. And a world class athlete to boot! It's off topic but so what. This girl is my dream.

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Old September 21st, 2004 #43
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With an ass and body as tight as that, I don't need "boobage". Besides, she's practically prepubescent. In 3 or 4 years the girl will be out of gymnastics, past puberty, and ready for my manly seed! I want her!

Come on, you'd be fucking one big muscle. She could contort around you like a snake. Ah, the sex would be incredible.

And she's probably 5'3, wouldn't you just love to manhandle a short woman?

 
Old September 21st, 2004 #44
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Naughty snapper talk.
Yes, it's great with a small passionate woman, the more you 'compress them with lovin' the more their explosive power grows.
You would have liked Nadia Comanici in her nubile prime.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bragi
With an ass and body as tight as that, I don't need "boobage". Besides, she's practically prepubescent. In 3 or 4 years the girl will be out of gymnastics, past puberty, and ready for my manly seed! I want her!

Come on, you'd be fucking one big muscle. She could contort around you like a snake. Ah, the sex would be incredible.

And she's probably 5'3, wouldn't you just love to manhandle a short woman?

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Old September 21st, 2004 #45
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http://www.vnnforum.com/showthread.php?t=9750

http://joevialls.altermedia.info/

Text. Adequate characters.






...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anima Eternae
Greeks were not Nordic. Not in the population sense. Exception is not the rule.




Link?



...
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Old December 31st, 2004 #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anima Eternae
I lived in Greece for a bit. Poorest country in Europe, but very lively place. Lots of pretty women, but I'd still rate Italian women as higher, though.




...
Poorest country in Europe? Wouldn't the Eastern European countries share that designation?
 
Old December 31st, 2004 #47
Draco
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doppelhaken
AE brought up that both Plato and modern day Greeks say that Macedonians to the north are more of a true Greek type, and that Greeks themselves have been darkening up. Draw your own conclusions from the time differential, but judging from these pics, it seems to be true. Sorry, you can see them expanded on the link above. The Macedonian girls on the left are clearly White, the other Greek girls could pass for Turks (I've been told Turk rapine is responsible for dark complected Greeks).
I have a family photograph taken in 1932 of all my relatives that came from Macedonia..theyre very tall, and rather thin, and look nothing like Greeks. As a black and white picture...i cant see their skin shade, but they look pale, and my grandfather and his brother were boys in that picture, they had fair skin as old men (when I knew them).

I once dated a girl from Greece in high school...all of her family members looked different...some fair, some swarthy, some tall, some short. Strange genes I guess, those Greeks.

As for other Macedonians, I've never seen one in person outside of my family.

No exaggeration.
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Old December 31st, 2004 #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bragi
What a beauty! Did anyone see her perform? I'd kill to deflower her. Sorry, not a pedophile, but she's just about legal.

Where is her ass! Oh, my god! Sorry just joking
 
Old December 31st, 2004 #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anima Eternae
Greeks were not Nordic. Not in the population sense. Exception is not the rule.
I have an interesting book here with me; it's from 1966, the pre-book burning days. (title: Universal History of the World- Volume 2- Ancient Greece) Here’s a site that describes it-

http://www.valerieslivingbooks.com/universa.htm

It's not a large book, might even be more oriented to children, but given the info in it I would say it gives more reliable info on Greece than any of the half-assed/shady internet sites I see. The important thing to remember about Greece is that many tribes have contributed to its ethnic makeup over the years. A couple of points:

- For hundreds of years, the original, timid, people of the Peloponnesus were tormented, looked down upon, and in some cases, enslaved or sacrificed to the gods by the more powerful Minoans (a Mediterranean people who lived on Crete)
- Around 1400 BC, however, the Minoan empire was destroyed; sacked by the now-warlike Greeks. It is mysterious how this change suddenly occurred. From the book:
Quote:
... Crete became just another Greek island

Across the plains of the Peloponnesus flashed the swift chariots of knights and warrior-princes. They wore armor of gleaming bronze, and bright, proud plumes bobbed over their helmets. They were the new men of a new country, and they called themselves Achaeans. Their kings called themselves the Sons of Pelops, the mighty chief and hero who had given his name to the Peloponnesus.

Pelops, the Achaeans said, was the son of a god. Probably, however, he was the grandson of a European invader, for many of the Achaeans’ ancestors were barbarians from the north. But they may have seemed like gods to the Shore People when they first hacked their way into the country. Their ragged beards and horned helmets were frightening to look at, and they fought like demons. They took the land they wanted, built fortresses, and settled down to stay.
Their behavior sounds very much like that of the Vikings, doesn’t it?

- A “Dark Age” began when the Achaeans were invaded by the Dorians . Concerning the Dorian invasion:
Quote:
The Achaeans had little time to enjoy their victory [vs. the Trojans], however, for suddenly their own cities were in danger. A new mob of invaders had found the paths that led south through the mountains from Europe. They had come from the Danube country, the no man’s land northeast of the mountains, and already they were fighting and plundering their way toward the Peloponnesus. Refugees, fleeing to the south, told horrible stories of the strength and cruelty of the invaders, whom they called the Dorians. They said that the Dorians were as fierce as the Achaeans’ own barbaric ancestors. They said that they fought with swords made of a new metal, iron, which could splinter the strongest bronze weapons.

… The Dorians took almost all of the Peloponnesus. The Achaeans who survived were pushed into a little corner on the northwest coast. This was a time of wandering and killing, a Dark Age which began about 1000 BC and lasted nearly 200 years.
- After this period, however, we come to Greek’s Classical Age.

The nordish.com site is down, but there is a very good map there that describes the Dorians as Nordics. More evidence of this is from the passage I cited concerning their weapons and origin. Iron-working was an Indo-European skill that they carried with them, and the Dorians invaded from the northeast of Greece, which is near the Indo-European homeland. There are two Dorian warriors depicted in the book that resemble Vikings; they have blond beards, horned helmets and iron swords. While I realize that an artist's depiction of a historical character cannot be taken as truth (I am not sean martin) there must be a reason why the Dorians are drawn this way; in obvious contrast to the Greeks they invaded.

You seem to suggest that the "Greeks" are a homogenous Mediterranean ethnic group that has existed for thousands of years, while in reality, many, many different peoples have lived there over the years. Dark haired/dark eyed Greeks would be survivors of the original population (some, however, obviously look Turkish); the Nordic-looking Greeks would be descended from the Achaeans/Dorians. This Nordic look doesn’t just exist in a minority of them by mere chance; it is result of the presence of Nordic peoples inhabiting the island throughout history, which you constantly deny.
 
Old December 31st, 2004 #50
King_Tiger
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Whoa...

Just found a pic of some hot Greek model. I know this isn't what the average Greek looks like, but... as the negroes say, "hot damn!"

 
Old December 31st, 2004 #51
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Here's a couple more; sorry for the lack of "decent" pics; it's actually hard to find one that's not topless. But I'm sure most of us won't mind.




 
Old December 31st, 2004 #52
Anima Eternae
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Quote:
it is result of the presence of Nordic peoples inhabiting the island throughout history, which you constantly deny.
I don't "deny" this.

I dispute that fact that people will make blanket statements calling Greeks "nords".


...
 
Old January 1st, 2005 #53
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Greeks are as white as a nation can be.Dont confused whites with nordics.All nordics are white but not all whites are nordics.
 
Old January 3rd, 2005 #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King_Tiger
Whoa...

Just found a pic of some hot Greek model. I know this isn't what the average Greek looks like, but... as the negroes say, "hot damn!"


TOPLESS IS DEFINITELY OK! ahem. just checking this thread in my capacity as moderator. ahem.
 
Old January 17th, 2005 #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King_Tiger
A “Dark Age” began when the Achaeans were invaded by the Dorians . Concerning the Dorian invasion:
The problem here is that most of you simply concider the Acheans, Dorians, Ionians, Myceneans, Minoans.................. to be different people, when all they were are just different tribes of the same "race"

Simple proof of this is Herodotus.
I'm sure nordic.com won't give this kind of info.

In Herodotus Book I, 56

"These races, Ionian and Dorian, were the foremost in ancient time, the first a Pelasgian and the second an Hellenic people. The Pelasgian stock has never yet left its habitation, the Hellenic has wandered often and afar. For in the days of king Deucalion it inhabited the land of Phthia, then in the time of Dorus son of Hellen the country called Histiaean, under Ossa and Olympus; driven by the Cadmeans from this Histiaean country it settled about Pindus in the parts called Macednian; thence again it migrated to Dryopia, and at last came from Dryopia to Peloponnesos, where it took the name of Dorian".

Quote:
You seem to suggest that the "Greeks" are a homogenous Mediterranean ethnic group that has existed for thousands of years, while in reality, many, many different peoples have lived there over the years. Dark haired/dark eyed Greeks would be survivors of the original population (some, however, obviously look Turkish); the Nordic-looking Greeks would be descended from the Achaeans/Dorians.
Of course Greeks are not a "pure race", but the available data demonstrate
that any potential introgression into the Greek gene pool were minor and did not replace the indigenous people. Hence, Fallmerayer's thesis has been disproved.There is more than enough genetic research to prove exactly what Anima Eternae has said :
Quote:
Greeks were not Nordic. Not in the population sense. Exception is not the rule.
Here are some samples(just ask for the whole article):

The most comprehensive study of Y-chromosomal diversity in Europe thus far is Rosser et al., [1]. The human Y chromosome is passed on from father to son. One can thus study one half of a population's ancestry (along the paternal line) by studying the Y-chromosome. Greek Y-chromosomes belong to haplogroups HG1, HG2, HG3, HG9, HG21 and HG26. None of the 35 Greek Y chromosomes are of non-Caucasoid origin.

A second Y-chromosome study including Greeks have also shown similar results. Helgason et al., [2] reports one HG16 sequence of North Eurasian provenance in a sample of 42 Greeks (at least 97.6% Caucasoid). To put this in perspective, eight HG16 chromosomes occur in 110 Swedes (at least 92.7% Caucasoid) and three HG16 sequences in 112 Norwegians (at least 97.3% Caucasoid) were also found. HG16 is shared by many populations ranging from Europe to Mongolia. Its origin has been placed by [7] in the Eastern range of its current geographical distribution.

To end this Turk fairy tale.
Proof in literature:
There are numerous references to brunets in ancient mythology and literature, e.g., the Muses, Poseidon, Alcmena, Theseus, Zeus, Dionysos and Odysseus are described as possessing either dark hair or dark eyes. Hercules, the Greeks' favorite hero is described as dark (melanan), hook-nosed (grupon) by Dicaearchus (Clement of Alexandria, "Protreptic to the Greeks" 2.30.7). Hercules was also proverbially melampugos (having a black behind) as indicative of his bravery, as opposed to pugargos (having a white behind), a coward . Irwin, E., 1974, Colour Terms in Greek Poetry, Hakkert, Toronto

The author of Aristotelis Physiognomica claims that both excessive paleness and excessive swarthiness are indicative of cowardice. Aristotle in the Eudemian Ethics mentions that "some men are blue eyed (glaukoi) and others black eyed (melanommatoi) because a particular part of them is of a particular quality" without assigning any moral superiority on either of the types. In the same passage, he continues that the blue-eyed man (glaukos) does not see clearly, an error which illustrates that he did not believe in a superiority of blue-eyed individuals. Indeed, the Greeks in general were somewhat repulsed by blue eyes, because of their rarity and association with disease (cataract and glaucoma), as Maxwell-Stuart, P.G., 1981, Studies in Greek colour terminology, vol.1 "Glaukos", Leiden : Brill in a complete study of all the uses of the adjective (glaukos) shows: Instinctive fear of blindness must be very strong among all sighted human beings, so their immediate reaction to such an eye will manifest itself in a repulsive frisson. Men will wish to ward off a similar fate from themselves.


Artistic Evidence:
Greek art furnishes important information about the racial type of the ancient Hellenes. Coon in observed that the beauty ideal of a straight nose and a lithe body was borrowed from Minoan Crete which was undisputably peopled by Mediterraneans.The characteristic nose-forehead continuity of idealistic depictions of gods and heroes is more typical of Mediterraneans than Nordics , although it was rare for ancient Greeks as it is for modern ones. Angel observes though, that his Dinaric-Mediterranean (Type F) morphological type approaches this ideal, in contrast to the Nordic-Iranian (Type D) in which the nasal bone projects at a sharp angle with the frontal bone.


Some more:

THE ORIGIN OF THE GREEKS BY ARIS N. POULIANOS
(1961, 1964, 1968, 1988)
(The book is sold out, but soon will be republished).

Four successive editions, constantly enriched with new data, are edited concerning the Anthropological - Ethnogenetic study of the Greek population. The basis of this work is Aris N. Poulianos dissertation, which took place in the University of Moscow, under the supervision of the famous professor of Anthropology F. G. Debetz. The research was based on the study of 70 human characteristics (p. ex. body height, width of face, skin colour, shape of eyes etc.) of about 3000 Greek emigrants (after 1949 civil war) in the f. Soviet Union from different Hellenic areas. The statistical elaboration of these characteristics in combination with their geographical distribution demonstrated mathematically (because of their low dispersion) the incessant biological continuity of the Greeks all through the historic and prehistoric epochs, which refer at least to the Mesolithic and Upper Palaeolithic periods (15.000-30.000 years). This historical continuity is also proved by the comparison of measurements of the contemporary inhabitants with those of the ancient skulls of Greece, which statistically show no differences. Despite the occasional influences and limited migrations of populations, the anthropological research has shown that the population of Greece is basically native and that the contemporary Greeks are descendants of the ancient peoples who resided in the Greek peninsula.

The alleged "Sub-Saharan" theory

In numerous recent studies, the mitochondrial DNA of Greeks was examined and was found to be predominantly Caucasoid with only infrequent presence of "erratic" sequences from non-Caucasoid sources. Mitochondrial DNA ("mtDNA") is inherited from one's mother and is thus a good way to establish the maternal ancestry of a population.

The most comprehensive European-wide study of mtDNA is [1] in which 125 Greeks were sampled among thousands of Europeans. The Greeks and the Albanians appear in the "Mediterranean-East" category of the study. Greeks tested belonged overwhelmingly to the Caucasoid-specific haplogroups ("Seven Daughters of Eve" popularized by Bryan Sykes' book).

The "erratic" sequences include a Sub-Saharan African (L1a) sequence, which was derived from the Albanian part of the sample [2]. The other two sequences non-attributed to a European founder are members of haplogroups prevalent in Asia, M and D. Thus, the total percentage of erratics in the Greek sample was 1.6%. The Greeks, like most Europeans are fairly pure in terms of their maternal ancestry.

It is sometimes argued that the Greeks absorbed large numbers of Negro slaves or immigrants. There is no evidence of such an event in Greek mtDNA. If it ever took place, it was so limited in scope that not a single sequence in a total of 125 could be found.

I hope you enjoy this. It proves nordic.com to be full of it.

New Rules for Historical Instruction in Germany (in Discussion and Correspondence), American Anthropologist, New Series, Vol. 36, No. 1. (Jan. -Mar., 1934), pp. 139-141.


 
Old January 18th, 2005 #56
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Your mom's full of it, and you bet she enjoys it.

Sorry. I just couldn't help myself. I'm sure that a meticulously researched dissertation such as yours must be right on the money.
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Old January 18th, 2005 #57
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I said I was sorry. That makes it all alright.
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Old January 18th, 2005 #58
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I'm not worried. I have loads of amusing board games to keep the old dodderer occupied. I'm not kidding, the selection really is first rate - not like the pitiful little collection in the retirement home's catnip-smelling lounge.
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Old January 19th, 2005 #59
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Which ones, Nordblod? I like boardgames, not to play them but as works of art.
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Old January 20th, 2005 #60
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Actually, I haven't a single one. That was just something I made up in order to make the joke more festive. Pretty smooth, huh?
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