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Old December 16th, 2014 #121
Alex Linder
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Originally Posted by Robbie Key View Post
I understand that, and get the point, but he is overly formal in my opinion. He doesn't need to tell us that he doesn't know of another translation of the text in question and stuff like that. Just do it, and present it. You're a freakin' professor.
Well, it's pretty quick stuff. The whole book is short. Also, giving your sources is simply honest. He's saying, like Pierce, check it out for yourself. Of course only a comparative few will know what he's talking about, but his peers would, and they count too. And the rest of us could look it up if we liked. It's kind of like making the text rich via HTML. It's a link sitting there to be used, but of course 99% of us will never use it, we do trust him, as you say.
 
Old December 16th, 2014 #122
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That's why despite being very important and compelling, Oliver's writings are not as well known as they should be. But then again, you have to consider, he's writing for a highly educated and intellectual audience, and he's a little dry like academics tend to be. Reading his stuff is like listening to opera, it's a taste you have to acquire, and that's when you start appreciating the challenging nature of his work.

I think personally there's a terrible shortage of academic work from the nationalist perspective that is on par with Kevin MacDonald and Revilo Oliver, this is thanks mostly to Jews banning whites who don't tow the line from academia. What needs to happen is we need people like Oliver to write, and other people to translate and simplify the ideas without sacrificing too much of their complexity, and yet another sector dedicated to turning this into effective propaganda. That's why the readings are good and Linder should comment on them more (without his libertarian ideological impositions ).

Whenever a cultural Marxist argues his ridiculous points, he has a plethora of fake research to tap into to back him up. Meanwhile, our side because of the way the system is designed, have only layman reality. But you'd be surprised at how much white people defer to men who use big words, especially whites who are smarter than the rest (which we need more of), so this barrier is something we have to break through to appeal to a good mix of people.

My suggestion: put a clothespin on your nose and trek through Oliver (same goes for Spengler), its more intellectually satisfying than first meets the eye.
I think MacDonald is a much better writer. For a life-long academic, he's actually outstanding. Even though his writings often are overloaded with facts, he's very succint in the way he presents it. It has a nice flow and doesn't ever annoy you.

I don't find that with Oliver. He over-complicates things. But I'm not a native English speaker, so I can't really appreciate his language in the same way as you do. Compare the recordings of Day's book and Oliver's book, and you'll see the difference.

Last edited by Robbie Key; December 16th, 2014 at 06:50 PM.
 
Old December 16th, 2014 #123
Joseph in VA
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Great stuff, Alex. Very informational and confirms that jews haven't changed.

I second that you go over some of the material at Calvin.edu at some point.
 
Old December 16th, 2014 #124
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I find Oliver's work largely lucid and enjoyable. The only thing I find annoying about it is it's stupid and uncharacteristically ignorant nordicism.
 
Old December 16th, 2014 #125
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I don't find that with Oliver. He over-complicates things. But I'm not a native English speaker, so I can't really appreciate his language in the same way as you do.
Well, he's a renaissance man, and he likes to flex his mental bicep. I agree with you on some level, however.

People who have trouble sifting through Oliver should listen to his myriad of talks and lectures. He was a pretty good speaker:

MacDonald's writing is more appealing, incredibly informative, and flies by when you read it, but his interviews and talks are really boring. Revilo is the reverse.
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Old December 16th, 2014 #126
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I find Oliver's work largely lucid and enjoyable. The only thing I find annoying about it is it's stupid and uncharacteristically ignorant nordicism.
Where does he display that? It's funny because I've never been able to really understand where he has his roots. Nordicism actually seems to be more common with people who doesn't have a typically Nordic look.



France? Italy? Wales? I don't know.
 
Old December 16th, 2014 #127
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I find it difficult to understand why the normally sensible Romans favored the scurvy jews over their civilized Greek brothers in Egypt.
 
Old December 16th, 2014 #128
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MacDonald's writing is more appealing, incredibly informative, and flies by when you read it, but his interviews and talks are really boring. Revilo is the reverse.
Agreed, MacDonald is terrible in-voice. Well, one can't be everything.
 
Old December 16th, 2014 #129
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Where does he display that? It's funny because I've never been able to really understand where he has his roots. Nordicism actually seems to be more common with people who doesn't have a typically Nordic look.



France? Italy? Wales? I don't know.
It's scattered here and there throughout his writings and speeches. Not all nordics are fair.
 
Old December 16th, 2014 #130
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It's scattered here and there throughout his writings and speeches. Not all nordics are fair.
I know that, being a brown-haired Nordic myself. Oliver, however, certainly isn't a Nordic-type man.
 
Old December 16th, 2014 #131
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Where does he display that? It's funny because I've never been able to really understand where he has his roots. Nordicism actually seems to be more common with people who doesn't have a typically Nordic look.



France? Italy? Wales? I don't know.
Oliver makes some odd assertions related to this in parts of his writing (not the one read in this thread). There's one debate where he tells Francis Parker Yockey that Emperor Ming of Han was Nordic.

Nordic theory as practiced by the Germans in the 30's is healthy because it was objective and the Nazis practiced empiricism in their research. Furthermore, they also believed "Nordic" was a characteristic that wasn't necessarily reflected by zoological standards like hair and eye color (IE, some nordics have dark hair and dark eyes, which is true). Later they scrapped this for pan-Aryanism when in practice Spaniards and Walloons demonstrated incredible courage and tenacity they felt only Nordics were capable of, and even were the last ones defending Berlin from the cowardly British they initially thought were their natural allies.

It's the politically motivated garbage promoted in the English speaking world by Chamberlain, Thomas H. Huxley, and Madison Grant that's the problem. This comes from the tradition of the British smearing their historical competitors by attacking their race and then stealing their history, as was done with the Italians, Spanish, Portugese, and later on the Germans (childish British propaganda would make caricatures of Hitler and imply that he was racially a mongoloid). To contemporary writers that continue in this tradition, like Arthur Kemp, Vasco da Gama and Napoleon had to have been Nordic because they did great things. Meanwhile every single empire in history has collapsed because either mediterraneans began to outnumber some universal nordic aristocracy that mysteriously chose to bring classical culture to Southern Europe first instead of Scandinavia and Britain, or even dumber, nordics mixed with blacks to create mediterraneans, as if the classical world was anything like the antebellum U.S. South or the 19th century British colonial experience.

Of course, this never applies to the similar rise and fall of truly Nordic empires like Sweden, or Britain itself.

The point about the people who promote Nordic theory being anything but is interesting. Kemp is pretty dark and quintessentially Alpine. Madison Grant looked so Iberian it stings. Someone sent me a picture of a certain blogger who is a Mexican Nordicist Harry Potter fan that dismisses everyone south or east of Germany that doesn't look like Dolph Lundgren as a "mudblood". Meanwhile, he not only isn't Nordic, he looks like John Leguizamos twin brother .
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"The favorite slogan of the reds is: 'No Pasarán!: Yes we have passed! And we tell them...and we tell them, we will pass again!'"
― Benito Mussolini after the Communist capitulation in Barcelona

Last edited by Joe_Smith; December 16th, 2014 at 07:49 PM.
 
Old December 16th, 2014 #132
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I don't agree. Oliver is virtually unique among PhDs in being funny and willing to use slurs. MacDonald you can sense holds himself back the entire way through Culture of Critique, I guess out of professionalism, or calculation that it's best the thing to do personally/politically, but all his data screams "Can you believe what an obnoxious groups of lying fucks these jews are?"

Oliver is not dry by any means compared to your average PhD or journalist, even. If he wants to come in high on his academic wings, that's fine, the audience should be looking up, and it underlines that he's trustworthy - go out and check my sources, he's saying, if you doubt me. I don't mind that. I really like that he dares, unlike many WN, to treat christianity with the contempt it deserves. He also, unlike 99% of WN, can treat the matter of race objectively and say that if we lose to the jews, we have nothing to complain about from a biological standpoint, and our refusal to consider that our standards aren't universal is our problem, not our enemy's fault for taking advantage of it. Even WN have been reduce to conservative bitches who do nothing but whine about unfairness and double standards. That's not how to win. Christianity will be the death of us, and christian conservatism holds nothing for our racial future but servility and slow slaughter, as we see in South Africa.

Last edited by Alex Linder; July 19th, 2015 at 06:35 AM.
 
Old December 16th, 2014 #133
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He also, unlike 99% of WN, can treat the matter of race objectively and say that if we lose to the jews, we have nothing to complain about from a biological standpoint, and our refusal to consider that our standards aren't universal is our problem, not our enemy's fault for taking advantage of it.
But his bitterness over the failure of what he calls conservatism in his lifetime tends to make him overemphasize the theory that Whites are intrinsically flawed and probably hopeless.

MacDonald seems to be less pessimistic and more interested in the future.

Of course Oliver is erudite and just plain hilarious at times. I don't think I've ever seen or heard MacDonald laugh, or write anything remotely funny (the best he does is wry).
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Old December 16th, 2014 #134
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But his bitterness over the failure of what he calls conservatism in his lifetime tends to make him overemphasize the theory that Whites are intrinsically flawed and probably hopeless.
It's not intrinsically flawed. Being trusting is not inherently a flaw, as Jared Taylor says. Much of white nature is good and bad - depending on context. Our flaws aren't flaws among ourselves, they're good things, many of them, or tolerable things - but they become flaws when we're faced by a hostile group.

Quote:
MacDonald seems to be less pessimistic and more interested in the future.
Well, he's alive.

Quote:
Of course Oliver is erudite and just plain hilarious at times. I don't think I've ever seen or heard MacDonald laugh, or write anything remotely funny (the best he does is wry).
To me, Oliver has the man's view. Objective, spare, hard. He doesn't bother with the love bilge like even Duke does nowadays, or all the conservative women. "Love your race" - what has that got to do with anything? Presumably all these people love their families, but all they respond to murder with is candlelight vigils. Love doesn't do shit. Fighting does shit. "Beauty will save us." Ok, Dr. Duke. Eye roll.

We must be HARD on ourselves as a race. Reflective. Self-critical. NONE of these qualities are found in the South or North. The south is anti-intellectual, stupid, and pig-happy in its mud. The north is fearful-respectable, neurasthenic, self-righteous. No winning qualities in any of this. We need high hard laughter, fighting in ideas and blood, resilience and fanaticism. Not this middle-class shit that Strom spread. WN is not about families and fucking picnics. It's about defeating an enemy which holds all the high positions and is working a plan to do us in.

We must be realistic -- see what is actually going on, not what we want to see or hope to see, but what is -- extremely smart and tough, resilient and fanatical. None of this moralizing about how bad/evil jews are, or how unfair/biased the institutions they set up and run us by. Oliver was an adult. That might be his best feature. Even the muslims get the deal with jews, but not the whiteskinned christians. We have to escape from that sicko cult to save our racial hide. I didn't start with that conclusion, I reached it, and the more I see, the more persuaded I am that it's right.

Whites must separate from christ-insanity, build something above all strong and immovable on essential principles. That will make it different from anything else in the field of white normalcy, and that will draw the better types as the real thing and the real chance.
 
Old December 16th, 2014 #135
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I'm mostly a "fuck naval-gazing", "direct the gunfire outward" type and likely need more respect for those hard looks into the mirror.

That said, the childish whiners and moaners have evidently seized on some of Oliver's speculations about White flaws and run with them over the years, ending in the "it's all our fault" school of jew-exculpation. Oliver didn't, and it's not his fault they did. He was simply thinking critically, and his position was the opposite of theirs.

It's hard to hear crit when one's teeth have been knocked out by an enemy -- one wants only to fight; but an adult should be able to hear it and consider it. (Think of all those nigger boxers who can't take coach's advice.)

Whites are a traumatized population, not really wanting to face the horror, the fact that our dicks are in the dirt and that some people really, really don't like us (to paraphrase Sally Field). This partly explains much recent childishness, evasion, retreats-into-fantasy, etc. The major cause of all that, though, is Christianity. It is the giant, comforting, mind-softening blanket or tit to hide under. That's why Oliver rightly reserved his severest criticism for Christianity (Chapter 7, "Christianity," is going to be a long one but crucial).
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Last edited by Sean Gruber; December 16th, 2014 at 11:32 PM.
 
Old December 16th, 2014 #136
Alex Linder
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E. Michael Jones, Living Machines, Chapter 3

http://www.vanguardnewsnetwork.com/M...nes-LM-Ch3.mp3

(1:19)
 
Old December 17th, 2014 #137
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Great stuff, Alex. Very informational and confirms that jews haven't changed.

I second that you go over some of the material at Calvin.edu at some point.
yeah i may. there are a million different choices. i would like to get the NS stuff on how they are not conservatives, how conservativers talk indoors to each other about stuff they already agree on, and fear the public and their enemies. how their sharpest minds write to impress one another rather than to grab the public and make them see the dangers and the importance of the cause.
 
Old December 17th, 2014 #138
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He is comparing russians to the american negro, and it's so true. Similar to my previous post.

http://vnnforum.com/showpost.php?p=1770728&postcount=69
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Old December 17th, 2014 #139
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Where does he display that? It's funny because I've never been able to really understand where he has his roots. Nordicism actually seems to be more common with people who doesn't have a typically Nordic look.



France? Italy? Wales? I don't know.
If we just have a look at the most innovative countries in the world we see;

1 Switzerland (Number 1 in 2012)

2 Sweden (2)

in the top 2. These tiny countries with a small population. Quite incredible.

http://knowledge.insead.edu/innovati...ndex-2013-2525
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Old December 17th, 2014 #140
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Good stuff about socialism. It's exactly how you put it, you are giving away your power to some asshat in the goverment who like most goverment workers are just dumb and ignorant. Socialism destroy wealth. It is the total productive capacity that is the wealth of a nation.
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